Namaskar, good evening. You're watching the news hour at 9:00
and I am Swati Joshi.
Well, today has been a triumph of 1I.
After 76 years of independence and four year legal struggle,
the dream of Sardar Patel of a truly integrated Akhand
Bharat has been realized.
Remember, this was also the undying vision of Syama Prasad
Mukherjee,
the founder of Jansang, who said Nahi Chalega Dobidhan do
Pradhan do Nishan.
Later, around 1984 at the Sung Shiksha Burg in Pune,
Narendra Modi called the Jammu and Kashmir land laws as
discriminatory.
In 1992, as part of the Tiranga Yatra,
Modi unfurled the Tricolor at Srinagars Lal Chowk.
This was a mission that Modi had embarked up on.
Finally, on 5th of August 2019,
Home Minister Amit Shah announced the abrogation of Article 370
on the floor of the House after a 4 year
legal battle.
Today the Supreme Court has upheld scrapping of Special status
of Jammu and Kashmir and upheld the abrogation of Article
370 as valid.
In an order hailed as a beacon of hope for
Indias true unity,
the Supreme Court said Article 370 was a temporary provision
and the President has the power to revoke it.
Upholding the bifurcation as well of Jammu and Kashmir,
the Supreme Court has directed the Election Commission to hold
elections by September
30th, 2024 and restore the statehood.
This can be seen as a big boost for the
Modi Sarkar ahead of
2024 Lok Sabha elections as the Prime Minister made good
on a key election pledge.
Today, the Prime Minister calls it an order of hope,
brighter future and resolve for a united India.
He also vowed to work for the vulnerable and marginalized
who suffered under Article 370.
Let's listen into the BJP.
Echoing the Prime Minister
maneuver nyala in a mana
Ki anuche tin. So sattar
E kastai pravdantha is me koi Sanka Kusanka
nahi
hai. ES
vedantic
sattar
Lok Sabha Mein kaha Gaya
kya bill ABI lambi the
Q jalbaj me la re
Supreme Court naya karegi. AAP ko raha dekh niche
Narendra
Modi, Jina John
Nira kyata
EE, beach masdar, me
chali sali no
NE galti akari
ASI
ke dasak
SE
galti, A karte aye sambhi or ETH.
Well, immediately after the verdict,
the marginalized and vulnerable in Jammu and Kashmir rejoiced.
Finally, refugees from West Pakistan,
Valmikis and even daughters of Kashmir get equal rights under
the Constitution.
However, regional satraps who have seen power slip out of
their hands have called this verdict against the idea of
India.
Listen
it
Supreme
Court
bulky idea of India Kihar Hindustan Kihar Hamari
Ki
hamari
possibility
Megani suktam hammer
result may be live sundata
or you unanimous judgmenti Yeh Sodkar
bahat Nerasha
Hui bahat
off
sh.
I must say Muthmani hai
or majority moral morality Kamiya be here
But has normalcy been restored to Naya Kashmir?
Let's get you some concrete data.
The number of terror incidents in Jammu and Kashmir have
declined from
2:28 in 2018 to 41 in
2023. The number of civilians killed has also declined
from 55 in 2018 to 13 in
2023. The number of security personnel who were killed in
action has also come down from
91 in 2018 to 20 in
2023. However, Congress insists that Article 370 was unconstitutionally removed.
Listen it
We respectfully disagree with the judgment
on the manner in which
Article 370 was abrogated.
We reiterate the CWC resolution
of 6th August 2019
that Article 370 deserved to be honored
until it was amended strictly in accordance with the Constitution
of India.
Remote Control Sarkar Chalana Chathi
Aaj do Ajar Choda Ki Baat Mahajan Nahi Hui
Jammu and Kashmir to
Mei ye Muda Uthana Chahata
Ki. Democracy, not autocracy, is the demand of every citizen
of Jammu and Kashmir.
Well, as you heard, the India bloc contends that the
people of Jammu and Kashmir have suffered after the abrogation
and that they want a democracy,
not autocracy. But let's cut through the political rhetoric and
get you a Fact Check.
There is 100% saturation in 17 central beneficiary schemes.
100% households in Jammu and Kashmir are now electrified.
There are
27.42 lakh beneficiaries in Jammu and Kashmir.
Under the PM Jandan Yojna,
Rupees
2517 crore has been credited to
12.55 lakh farmers. Under PM Kisan Yojana,
3.84 lakh houses have been sanctioned under PM Awas Yojana,
12.53 lakh LPG connections have been given under PM Ujwala
Yojana.
The numbers are there on your screens for you to
see.
And all the data, the reactions that we are getting
and of course the observations of the top court leaders,
to our legitimate question,
the legitimate question is why oppose Akhand Bharat?
Why are still Netas doubting the process saying the procedure
was wrong after the court has settled the issue of
constitutionality?
You're watching the news hour at 9 debate number one
on Times Now,
Super prime time.
Let's open this up and go across to our guest
tonight.
We are joined by Sanju Varma,
National Spokesperson of the BJP.
We have Abhijit Ayyan Mitra,
Senior fellow, IPCS, Sushant Sareen,
Senior Fellow, ORF, Tehseen Poonawalla,
Political analyst here in the studio.
With me we have Sujada Bashir,
state spokesperson of
DPAPGM Shaheen, JDU president from Srinagar.
And we also have advocate Nilufar Masood,
leader of the JKNC. Good evening to all of you.
Want to begin with, you advocate Nilu.
For Masood, the issue of constitutionality has been settled by
the top court.
And every objection that was raised on bifurcation,
on whether Article 370 was temporary or permanent,
on whether the exercise of power by the President was
right or not,
was it with the Malef ID intention.
All of that has been settled by the court.
Then why is it that Mehba Mufti still is calling
this against the idea of India?
And what fight are we talking here about that Omar
Abdullah and Mehba Mufti say will continue.
There is no doubt about it that we are disappointed
with the verdict which has come from our honourable Supreme
Court.
In fact, Article 370 was elected to put a seal
on the commitment so which was made by the Government
of India when the
instrument of assertion was signed by the Union of India.
And at that time Jammu Kashmir was independent Princely state.
Though the commitments which were made in the year
1949, it never came in the way of development prosperity.
Because you could see that Jammu and Kashmir was one
of the states which was in fact betterly placed than
other states which are still underdeveloped.
So we can never connect 370 with the
development, prosperity and all that.
It was in fact the commitments which were made by
the Government of India for the people of Jammu and
Kashmir.
It's true that we are disheartened but it never means
that we'll give up.
We have political way, we have democratic way and the
constitutional right
to disagree. Dissent from the judgment which has come up
and we'll see the ways and mean how we can
proceed further.
Yeah, Visa was the judgment because still it has some
Gray
areas which needs to be answered,
right. You know it will be.
It will be better for our viewers as well and
for the debate.
Also, if you can be very specific about the objections
that you and your party leaders have now opposed the
issue of constitu constitutionality being settled by the court.
If you could be very specific.
See about the reorganization, the verdict is not clear about
it.
Number. Second, why the state has been degraded to the
UT since there is no such provision in our own
constitution which lays down as state can be degraded.
It's again a open debate and it has not been
answered there.
Yeah, it's true that a state can be
bifurcate, it can be boundaries can be changed or a
new state can be formed by way of the Article
3.
But it the answer, but the answer has remain unanswered,
in fact that it has not given any verdict with
respect to why a state of Jammu and Kashmir has
been degraded to a state.
This is one of the matters and there are so
many other things because
we have to go through the judgment also and one
the judgment will be there.
It will be clear
was never enacted at a time when there were warlike
situation.
It is not like that on the issue of statehood,
the center has told the court and the court has
also now settled deadline saying
conduct elections there by 30th September
2024. So. So the center has already said statehood is
going to be restored.
We have been hearing it from last so many years
and even our Amit Shah has also said in the
parliament also before some four years on 5th August
2019 that the elections will be held,
statehood will be restored. These are all promises which have
been made and I don't find any
such situation coming very near that we can expect these
things to happen.
All right, So let's let's bring in Sanju Verma on
that,
on the promises that remain unfulfilled as far as statehood
being restored is concerned.
And we will go across to other guests also the
Gray area that you talked talking about advocate Masood response
Sanju Verma,
you know,
so party first and foremost I think Prime Minister Modi
and Home Minister Amit Shah.
Let's be under no illusion these are the two men
who ensured that Article Three 70s aggregation was brought to
fruition.
Something should that should have happened long back
immediately after the J&K Constituent Assembly was disbanded
in January 1957. Be that as it may,
I think very quickly, you know,
you put out some brilliant data.
And adding to that, I will also say
that you know the most important thing which has happened
post aggregation of Article 370 is not the fact that
7th Pay Commission recommendations
are now applicable there. It's not the fact that from
being a part deficit,
Jammu and Kashmir is virtually a past surplus state.
I will not mention about the fact that in the
last nine months alone,
1 1/2 core tourists have have visited Jammu and Kashmir
and it has regained its buoyancy in terms of being
a vibrant tourist destination.
I will not talk about the fact that stone pelting
incidents have come down by
99% and terror incidents have come down by
73%. I will not talk about the fact that earlier
there was not even one nursing college.
Today there are one 5:15.
Earlier there were only 500 medical seats in Jammu and
Kashmir.
Today there are 1300. All the fact that earlier there
were only four medical colleges,
Today seven more have been added.
All the fact that there's an
I I TIIM in Jammu.
There are two aims, one which has come up and
one which is underway.
But the most important point is this,
that under path 21 of the Constitution,
Article 370 was always meant to be an interim measure.
It was meant to be temporary
and transitional and that is something which Justice
CJI, Justice Chandra Chood reinforced in no uncertain terms.
And you know when this whole argument is being made
by the National Conference.
I earlier saw some tweets by Omar Abdullah which made
zero sense saying that you know,
you can't degrade a state into a union territory.
Let me tell you this particular issue about the so-called
degradation of J&K from a state into a union territory
came up in February
2023 and a 2 judge bench led by Justice Sanjay
Call because the petitioner said that it is only the
Election Commission which can decide,
you know, whether the state needs to be reduced to
a UT status.
And Justice Sanjay Call said that under
Article or you know Section
62A and 62B of the
People's Representation Act of 1951 and the path restored under
the Election Commission wide Article
320-4325, 320-6327 and 328, the Election Commission does have the
power,
but the Delimitation Commission also has the power to reduce
the status of a state to a union territory.
And why the JLDK reorganization
of 2019 and why the Delimitation Amended Act of
2002? If there has been a reduction in the status
of J&K from being a state to a union territory,
that is all good and kosher.
OK, before the test, I know you want to come
in,
but before you come in,
I quickly want to bring in Sujada Bashir,
state spokesperson of the DPAP now while advocate NILU for
Masood,
said that 370 was never an impediment or hurdle when
it comes to development of Jammu and Kashmir.
When a law is discriminatory and does not allow equal
rights to
individuals, especially who belong to the marginalized,
the vulnerable section, how can you say that there was
development,
There wasn't any development. To be very frank,
nothing has been done. After the
2019 fifth August, they said that there,
there will be a Naya Kashmir,
What do you say? By Naya Kashmir?
There wasn't any development after that.
Even the militancy is still there.
The officers are getting killed.
Does that mean that is a development?
Our kids are still in the jails that.
Does that mean we are in a development?
We have a lots of unemployment here.
There's no development in it.
The ask the people of Jammu and Kashmir,
are they happy with this verdict?
No one is happy in this verdict.
Neither the leaders, neither the people of Jammu and Kashmir
that is there or this was their option to remove
it and they did it
race. None of the Kashmiri or individual is that individual
opinion that you have that
you have. Yes. Is that an individual opinion of yours
that people are not happy or have We have.
We have we have the access to data of some
survey conducted right after Supreme courts verdict.
No you asked from yesterday.
We are watching that they have put the so much
obscurity.
Why? If they said that there's a change,
where is the change? Why they are so scared to
put the security on the roads?
If they said the people are happy with this verdict,
then why to put the security?
Why to put why to make anything such a things
that the people are scared to come out of the
houses?
They said the five people cannot gather at one place.
What is the reason the people are just ask on
the ground level,
Are the people of Jammu Kashmir happy with this verdict?
None of them. And why it was supposed to remove
in Jammu and Kashmir only,
there are lots of states in jail.
People who have been discriminated against today definitely are enjoying.
People whose rights have been restored definitely are happy.
Again. I'm asking you, are you putting forward only your
individual opinion And speaking for the entire population of Jammu
and Kashmir,
Abhijitaya Mitra Abhijitaya Mitra Sujada Bashir says nothing has changed.
There is no development. People are still getting killed.
Our boys are still in jail.
There's no development happening pre or post abrogation.
Okay, okay. Now take a counter.
Ma'am, take a counter. I'm saying yesterday only there was
a fire.
So on the Bamina area,
Okay the development, the military is still
there.
OK ma'am, please take a counter.
So why to remove the Article 3?
Take a counter. Ma'am, take a counter.
Swati, can I? Yes, thanks.
So thanks Swati. So first of all,
let's remember there's a huge difference between an insurgency and
a
random attacks of terror. What we're seeing now are terror
attacks,
which if you remember happened in Punjab as well.
Remember the Chief Minister Bian Singh there was blown up
by a suicide bomb well after the insurgency ended.
So first and foremost, the insurgency as well and truly
ended in Kashmir
#1 #2. What has happened is the reason all these
people are so upset was
that the entire previous 20-30 years since
1990 have been an endless gravy plane.
Kashmir accounted for just 1%
of revenue and 10% of all budgetary expenditure of the
Indian Union.
OK, so everything that was good about Kashmir was essentially
being sustained.
Nearly 55% of the population was dependent on government handouts.
Today they finally started going back to tourism.
Tourism has gone through the roof.
This was always a tourism sustaining economy.
What these people are so upset about is that the
entire conflict economy of profiting of terrorism is painted.
Why do they want elections as well?
Let's talk about that. Remember that entire election set up
was one of a gravy trade where you keep circulating
money,
lots of it, black money over
and over again. So all of that has been.
Now let's also be clear about
the insurgency is development takes time,
but right now you are seeing fantastic tourist development.
What exactly do these people want in terms of change?
You don't have those check posts there anymore.
The security presence is drastically reduced.
Nothing has changed. Come on,
really. This is this based on some,
you know,
self self ticketing, you know,
I'm a secular liberal. I know everything,
etcetera, etcetera. Yes, self certification,
nature, time. You know, this is not North Korea,
where you could declare yourself the Democratic Peoples Republic and
decide things.
Lastly, Swati, I just want to make a point.
Ambedkar, who I think knows more about the Constitution than
all of us put together,
and possibly even the Supreme Court put together because he
was the founding father of the Constitution,
very clearly says this, that India is the indestructible union
of destructible states.
You go through the Constituent Assembly notes and
his own speeches. He will show you.
In great detail, how states can be destroyed,
they can be reformed, they can be put to Union
territories,
the legislators can be taken away,
et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
If you will permit me two seconds,
I'm just going to read out his speech,
a short section of his speech from the twenty
25th of November 1949, Ambedkar.
In the constitutional debate, it may be that the Constitution
assigns to the Centre 2 larger fields for the operation
of its legislative and executive authority that is to be
found in any other federal Constitution.
It may be that the residual powers are given to
the Centre and not to the States,
but these features do not form the essence of federalism.
The chief mark of federalism,
as I said, lies in the partition of the legislative
and executive authority between the center and the units by
the Constitution.
He does not say states.
He says units by the Constitution,
which means you can be a Union territory and you
can.
The center can decide what path to give you.
You can be a state and the center can decide
what path to give you.
There are places like Andaman and Nicobar and Lakshaddeep,
which are Union territories which do not have a legislature.
Are there any less democratic?
No, I'm sorry, but this is not how things work.
So, you know, these people can concoct,
remember we're talking about people who have essentially been living
off the
the, the ruling class who have been parasiting and living
off the rest of Indias revenues for the last 30
years.
All right. They don't want to work for a living.
Kashmiris are keeps happy. OK.
I want to bring in thesim Punawala as well because
there are a lot of political reactions and
it is quite contradictory as well.
You know, talking about the Indi block,
thesim punawala, what is the stand of the opposition today?
Because Udhav Thakre faction is well becoming this decision.
On the other hand many still you know,
maintaining a safe distance from calling it a welcome step.
Sorry. First of all thank you for having your show.
And to Sanju, Abhijeet, Sushanji and everybody on the panel
and all our fellow citizens.
I'm glad that this matter has been put to rest.
370 has been abrogated and the Supreme Court has puts
its seal to it.
So congratulations on that part.
It's now time for Jammu and Kashmir to heal and
to move on.
I think
I disagree with Abhijeet on one point and also with
Sanjuji.
The down grading of a state to a Union territory
is unacceptable and unfortunately the most honorable Supreme Court left
that question open.
So, So while I do respect and I absolutely welcome
the honorable Supreme Courts judgment on 370 and finally putting
the final nail in the coffin of the of this
demand of 370,
this question should have been answered because what
Abhijeet is saying is very very dangerous.
Look the examples of Andaman and Nicobar or etcetera don't
hold true.
Can my state of Maharashtra tomorrow suddenly the assembly be
suspended,
Parliament take upon powers upon itself of the legislative assembly
of Maharashtra and downgraded to a state?
Or can my city of Mumbai tomorrow be converted to
a union territory because the state decided its very dangerous
to think that can the assembly of Karnataka be suspended
permanently? Second, while I do welcome the SGS commitment and
the honourable Supreme Courts direction that statehood should be restored
by September
2024 and elections be held,
this is only the commitment of the SG,
its not only affidavit by the Government of India.
While honourable Home Minister Amit Shetty did see this in
Parliament,
this isn't an affidavit in the court and therefore I
think the Supreme Court should have pushed the Honourable SG
to bring this as a commitment from the Government of
India that statehood would be restored.
Because every Kashmiri, I think does Jammu and Kashmiri citizen
does want the statehood to be restored.
So I think that that are two important issues that
we have to grapple with as as as
as a nation. But I do agree with Abhijeet totally
on the far part that what Ambedkar Ji said,
look, we are an indestructible union.
The Union is, is supreme and I think that's what
the Supreme Court has upheld within,
within the various identities that we all have.
The one common identity between Sujadaji,
Sanju, Abhijeet, me, Sushant, all of whom all of us
are diverse,
is the identity of being an Indian.
That identity is absolutely supreme and that can never,
ever be changed. So just one,
so just one point. Anybody,
anybody who dreams of anything
outside the Constitution or the Union of India is doing
a great disservice to this great country for which we
all or our forefathers fought to give us this independent
Sushant Sai. I want to bring you in because what
Tasin Poonawala just said,
is that a genuine concern?
Is that just part of fear mongering?
The tomorrow the government will and can I take a
decision on turning any state into a Union territory,
Cholo Maharashtra, Go Union territory.
Is that part of fear mongering?
Is that a genuine concern?
No. I would imagine that's a genuine concern.
Because if you can do it with one state,
you can do it with any other state.
And if a government at the center is particularly vicious
and has, you know, an opposition party,
although you can impose President's Rule if it's a reasoned
order
and there are compelling circumstances for it.
But if the government at the center at with the
parliamentary majority decides that it's going to convert a state
into AUT,
then you know no state is safe.
And I think the Supreme Court has eluded to that
particular issue but not pronounced on it.
And what the quote and I I'm afraid I disagree
with most of my fellow panelists who say that there's
a time limit of September 24th.
In fact, from whatever I heard,
I've still to read the judgment.
But whatever I heard from the pronouncements of the Chief
Justice when he was reading out the judgment,
it's very clear that the court has said that,
look, we have not gone into this issue of statehood
because the government at the central government has assured us
that statehood will be restored.
They have not prescribed a time limit to it.
So, and they've said that elections have to be held
by September 24th whether or not statehood is restored.
That is what I heard.
If I've heard it wrong,
somebody should correct me. They've not prescribed a time limit
#1 #2. I think the the judgment today in it
and of itself as Swati
was a historic and a landmark judgment because it settles
a lot of these nonsensical issues which have been raised
including by people from
Decenes party. You know, this nonsense about India is not
it's a union of States and stuff like that.
Utter nonsense with anybody who had read the Constitution would
tell you what Abhijeet has just said that it is
an indestructible union of destructible states.
So yes, you can convert,
you know, you can, you can lop off a part
of our state and make it into a Union territory
and you can do stuff like that.
But you know this whole thing that,
you know, it's the states have their own sovereignty.
I think the court has shot that down.
I need to clarify a couple of things which I
think Miss Masoodi was making.
You know, #1, let's be very clear.
The Instrument of Accession that the Jammu and Kashmir
state signed with the Union of India
is no different from the Instrument of Accession that every
other princely status signed with the Union of India.
No different. Nothing whatsoever. Right.
And I think the court has clarified what you know,
how, how the subsequent process
went on #2. You know,
there was this separateness which 370 seemed to have inculcated,
at least at the psychological level.
We might still have to do a lot of work
on it,
but at least legally speaking,
that psychological separation has been finished with the constitutional reforms
which took place on August
5th, 2019. I think that's a remarkable thing which has
happened.
You know, the the physical integration was already there,
but the legal and psychological integration has now been completed.
All right, it takes some more time,
but I think that's been done.
But I think no, the psychological separate.
No. That is so good.
You know, since GM Shine is not spoken.
No, no,
OK, quickly, quickly if you could just.
No, no, no, Let let Mr.
Sushant finish his counter from GM Shine.
Swati. We have to be mindful of one thing.
A lot has changed in 2019 in Kashmir.
A lot of stuff for the better has changed in
since 2019.
But I don't think we should be taken in by
our own kool-aid.
We should not be fooled by it.
Kashmir remains a volatile place and we cannot be careful
enough.
So if, for example, there was some apprehension of breach
of peace because of the Supreme Court judgment and you
impose certain prohibitory orders,
that's par for the course.
That's surely administer. That was keeping in mind the security
situation.
There no no
GM Shine piece before before you come in
testing GM Shine, Sushant Sarin says that the psychological separateness
has been removed.
Now how do you respond to the verdict?
Of course, and what your fellow panelists had to say.
Swati, thank you. You are giving the chance to speak
in your program today.
And there is a proverb.
There is a proverb that Mera kathili mera munsip munsip
hai,
kya mere hakuma fasla dega
just. I was. I was listening to tasin poonawalla.
I was listening to sushant.
I I listen, I heard,
I heard you are BJP spokesman,
Mr. Shaheen. Are you saying that the Supreme Court of
India is in Congress to the Government of India?
Let him
finish. No. When you say Mera cartooning,
are you saying I'm. I'm seriously asking you to speak.
I want you to speak.
The Supreme Court of India isn't
when you are. When you are speaking,
I never argue. Let me explain what
is said by you. No,
no, let me explain what he said.
He he like a good person.
Be like a good person,
a good man on debate.
Gigi, go ahead and debate.
Don't shout. Who shouting?
I was just listening to Asim Poonawalla Know I am
happy that abrogation 370 has gone.
Yes nobody nobody wants to Abrogation 370.
Would you, Would you, Would you what state going to
accept duty tomorrow?
Would you Would you accept?
Would you know what is happening in Ladakh?
Would you know what what what that Sonam Sonam Wanchik
is doing?
Would you know he is?
He is on strike from last two years.
Would you allow to the people of Jammu and Kashmir
to speak?
Would Adibadi. OK tell me complete day I was watching
your television programs
would you tell me how many Kashmiri people was on
your panel.
Hardly. We have a two people are from Kashmir right
now One is my my dear sister or daughter.
I can I can tell that that is one of
the advocate from national poppers and other lady other my
daughter is from DPAP Gulabi Azad sabs party.
I appreciate the brave girls.
I appreciate them. They are speaking on the on the.
They are having the voice of the people.
They are speaking on the behalf of the people of
Kashmir.
But the 1st 10 years
from last five years. Madam,
please, please let me speak.
Let me speak.
Five years has gone, Five years has gone.
Just ask us Tasin Poonawalla,
if university election will not be done in five years,
what will you do? Five years has gone.
We are begging for the elections and you are not.
You are not doing elections in Jammu and Kashmir.
How much time you will keep the Governor,
Left and border on the head of our we people
here in Jammu and
on that issue. OK, on that issue.
On that issue, as far as elections,
elections in Jammu, Kashmir are concerned.
Well take a response on Sanju Varma.
But today yes. But today Mr.
Shahin believe you said that we knew about the verdict
coming and I said before that we should not expect
much from the Supreme Court.
What did you mean by that
Shahin Ji when you said you should not expect much
from the Supreme Court?
What did you mean?
No, no. My question is only I am Indian.
Would you know that what will Mr.
Narendra Modis are telling me that that I am the
first person who had the
flag in Lal Chok? Would you know that in
1991 I was the first man who had the flag
in Lal Chok?
Would you know that I have a bullet sitting in
my leg?
Tell me who's denying DNA is first?
I am a true Indian.
Where is this question of people are true Indian?
What is the point that you're trying to make again?
I'm asking you, Sir, what is the point that you're
trying to make?
My question is only nobody is questioning if you made
sacrifices.
If you made sacrifices for the nation,
Sir. Nobodys questioning if you made sacrifice for the nation.
Nobodys questioning if you made sacrifices for the integrity
of the nation. I'm asking you the point that you're
trying to make.
Can you be more specific?
My only question Swati Madam,
Swati Madam. My question is I am telling that I
am true Indian.
I am the first man who had the flag in
my hand.
But my country people the by BJP spokesperson,
they are not going to accept.
That is the problem. OK
then then Sir. Then Sir,
why do you need, why do you need 370?
We are all Indians.
No, no. There should be true integration.
Why do we need 370
Madam
Sachin I will come back to just want to make
sure I will be here
but but but but are you talking on the phone
Are you talking talking to me?
I want to only I want to only my secret
hood back
Why don't you Why don't the Government of India has
given me statehood Why don't you are giving me OK
Why don't you give statehood for elections into my Kashmir.
What is the Sanju Verma.
Yes Sanju Verma On the on the question of statehood
please respond
GM Shine. GM Shine is saying Pansal hoga up up
cup Karengeya.
When, when will you restore statehood?
I'm answering that. You know,
first and foremost I just want to say a couple
of things.
With no offense to Tasin and Sushant Sareen.
When they say that you know it is indeed a
dangerous
trend. You know that any states
status from being a state could be reduced to that
of a UT.
That could set a precedent.
I just have this to say,
I did not. Hetch Hindi please.
You asked a question, now take a response.
State
please,
I just want to say this,
that under Article 1-2 and three of the Constitution,
this was mentioned in the judgment given by Justice Sanjay
Kaul in February
2023 and elucidated and elaborated upon today by the CJI
that the central government,
in this case the Modi government,
is well within its right and more
to redraw the electoral and the demographic and the geographical
map of India,
what have you. So if
Jammu and Kashmir has been reduced from being a state
to a Union territory with legislature,
and Ladakh a Union territory without legislature,
it is entirely constitutionally bona fide.
Point number one, point #2,
even if you look at Article
245 of the Constitution, which delineates the powers between executive,
legislature and the judiciary. But can
you Can you respond to the one specific point?
Statehood. Restoring statehood? When will elections happen?
If you notice the recommendations of the Ranjana Desai LED
the Limitation Commission report.
Swati came out in May
2020 first and we raised the number of seats from
100 and seven,
214 and
ma'am, elections. Elections, Yes, I'm coming to that,
Swati, do not Heckle me.
I'm not heckling you since that.
That's that's one question all the panelists have asked.
Now to move on to debate #2 also,
yes, so I'm just saying that it is only a
little over over a year back that we decided that
scheduled costs
will get seven seats, schedule tribes will get nine seats,
one seat will be reserved for a person displaced.
When you know PFK happened 2 will be given to
Kashmiri migrants.
This entire semantic was brought to fruition only a little
over a year back.
OK, yes. The Supreme Court has said September
30th, 2024 is the deadline for me.
We will. OK, the government says we have.
We've made that promise. Tasin poonawala.
I am short on time here.
Can you very quickly in just 10 seconds make your
.2 things? The question of can a state be reduced
to Union territory?
And the Article 3 has been left open by the
honourable Supreme Court,
and that's my disappointment. They should have done that because
I agree with Mr.
Shine, you cannot do it.
But more importantly, Sushant, just to read out the portion
that is relevant for us,
we direct the steps shall be taken by the Election
Commission of India to conduct elections to the Legislative Assembly
of J&K constituted under section 14 of the Reorganization Act
by 30th September 2024. The restoration of statehood shall take
place at the earliest and as soon as possible.
So the statehood has to come first before the elections.
Its extremely clear there is no ambiguity in this.
The next, of course, the next big step is restoration
of statehood.
The next thing that everybody is going to watch out
for are the elections.
And the big question from the center is when is
that going to take place.
Gentlemen, Sanju Verma, Sujada Bashir and Advocate Neelo for Masu.
Thank you very much for joining us on the broadcast.
Sanju Verma, Abidar Mitra Tehseen Poonawala will stay on with
US
#2 as well.